tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1467233175753661815.post5160985149436519080..comments2023-12-31T11:28:36.755-05:00Comments on the dayton time: certain tragedy often causes us to fight.Pamelahttp://www.blogger.com/profile/13652737346135197054noreply@blogger.comBlogger32125tag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1467233175753661815.post-48169168831850195492009-06-03T22:57:44.403-04:002009-06-03T22:57:44.403-04:00...and quite a contrast from the post I just read ......and quite a contrast from the post I just read but just as entertaining from a totally different angle. Great point of view - IMHOLindsay Lebresco (Graco)http://blog.gracobaby.comnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1467233175753661815.post-13081914022879528902009-06-02T11:08:03.316-04:002009-06-02T11:08:03.316-04:00Wow. Love this! Found you because you started foll...Wow. Love this! Found you because you started following me on Twitter.<br /><br />I have long felt that the Old Testament can be summed up by The Golden Rule (Do unto others... not "he who has the gold..."), that the New Testament can be summed up by "God is Love" and that if we could manage to live by those -- all of us, every moment -- this would be Heaven on Earth.<br /><br />I also agree that though I know I could never have an abortion, I don't want it to be illegal. I feel much as you do that efforts should be placed on loving those children (and their pregnant mothers who are someone's child too). If every child was truly seen by our society as a gift from God then I don't think abortion would be chosen by many as a way to fix a problem -- because being pregnant would be seen as an honor, not a problem.<br /><br />You wrote this really well!kyouellhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/02992252292707394134noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1467233175753661815.post-79357238029860959302009-06-01T12:42:25.292-04:002009-06-01T12:42:25.292-04:00Can I get an AMEN?!Can I get an AMEN?!Jesshttps://www.blogger.com/profile/05629507098900851541noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1467233175753661815.post-14447296635507735312008-11-03T20:45:00.000-05:002008-11-03T20:45:00.000-05:00Excellent post! I was worried when I saw this was ...Excellent post! I was worried when I saw this was a post on abortion. I thought I'd have to get all angry and cranky, and have to come up with some wordy rebuttal.....but no! You expressed my sentiments exactly. Very well done! Thank you for posting this.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1467233175753661815.post-74186881452847201272008-11-03T15:22:00.000-05:002008-11-03T15:22:00.000-05:00I am here too courtesy of Ree.Good on you for what...I am here too courtesy of Ree.<BR/><BR/>Good on you for what you say. You say it so well.jeaniehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/17322709527738134797noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1467233175753661815.post-17545358495015422212008-11-03T12:11:00.000-05:002008-11-03T12:11:00.000-05:00I came here via Ree's blog and I'm glad I did. Yo...I came here via Ree's blog and I'm glad I did. You have written an excellent post. Thank you.jeanhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/05925212233815659494noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1467233175753661815.post-24059412739162708722008-11-03T11:03:00.000-05:002008-11-03T11:03:00.000-05:00Well said. A good goal would be to stop the hate ...Well said. A good goal would be to stop the hate and polarizing and get to work FIXING things. You nailed a lot of the key problems behind this. <BR/><BR/>And I agree 100%. The Jesus I read about in the NT was a man of great compassion and love for those who were least loveable. What a goal to strive to.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1467233175753661815.post-43126650947877794382008-11-03T10:55:00.000-05:002008-11-03T10:55:00.000-05:00Wandered over here from Ree's place. I must say B...Wandered over here from Ree's place. I must say Bravo. Yes Abortion is horrible, however, someone else brought up that God did not call us to change the laws but to uphold His laws and do what He tells us to do and by our actions, guide others. So before we can demand the end of Roe vs. Wade we need programs in place to care for the pregnant ones who aren't in a spot to be pregnant. We need to educate teens on the fact that babies are cute for a few hours but then they become work and a responsibility. We,as a nation, are failing and you have hit the nail on the head and I thank you for your post and I will be linking back to it just as Ree did.carriehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/01729558663574731415noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1467233175753661815.post-7818457426868021062008-11-03T10:54:00.000-05:002008-11-03T10:54:00.000-05:00I'm not religious or political but that post made ...I'm not religious or political but that post made nothing but perfect sense to me.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1467233175753661815.post-64638218611337405922008-10-22T15:48:00.000-04:002008-10-22T15:48:00.000-04:00I'm so sorry... I certainly didn't intend to attac...I'm so sorry... I certainly didn't intend to attack anyone. <BR/><BR/>Pamela, do you feel attacked??<BR/><BR/>I do have to make an additional comment, though. <BR/><BR/>The bible does say that although we are not of the world, we are in it. And it does say that we need to submit to our government. However, the implication of Jesus' life of compassion, mercy, and uncompromising holiness is that we as Christians are also to be so. <BR/><BR/>Jesus says in Matthew 5:13<BR/>"You are the salt of the earth. But if the salt loses its saltiness, how can it be made salty again? It is no longer good for anything, except to be thrown out and trampled by men."<BR/><BR/>Salt is a preservative. I think the implication is that where we can lovingly and mercifully stand for the principles upheld in God's word, then we should do so. Including doing just that as we exercise our right to vote and thus influence our own government.<BR/><BR/>StephanieAnonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1467233175753661815.post-46180337345248061112008-10-21T12:34:00.000-04:002008-10-21T12:34:00.000-04:00Listen, first of all - you wrote this soooo well, ...Listen, first of all - you wrote this soooo well, and I agree with ALL of it.<BR/><BR/>Nowhere in my bible does God tell us to change laws! He says - dont' involve yourselves with bad stuff! If you disagree with abortion - DON'T HAVE ONE! Your movement is NOT WORKING. Your Republican president is NOT WORKING! 8 yrs and a steadily increasing abortion statistic! The reason? Presidents don't decide that issue..they only get to decide on one- maybe two judges during a term..and those judges may or may not vote on that particular issue. Maybe if all this time and effort and passion could be shifted to taking care of 'born' babies, unwed teen mothers, and educating teens on how NOT to get pregnant and how to RESIST temptation y'all might actually get somewhere with this fight. You are fighting in VAIN with this. I know your intentions are good, but your actions are fruitless and you know what the bible says about that? look it up.<BR/><BR/>And also, quit attacking other Christians who have a different take on things - there's room for all of us huh?Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1467233175753661815.post-33377362483131518772008-10-20T22:07:00.000-04:002008-10-20T22:07:00.000-04:00I pray that teen MOPS is one manifestation in our ...I pray that teen MOPS is one manifestation in our community of protecting those who are born as well as those who chose to give birth.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1467233175753661815.post-25361000352738161402008-10-20T16:30:00.000-04:002008-10-20T16:30:00.000-04:00Misquoted."And to say that allowing kids to be bor...Misquoted.<BR/><BR/>"And to say that allowing kids to be born into a sucky environment is WORSE than killing them before they're born..."<BR/><BR/>I didn't say that it was worse. I said, <EM>What kind of job can we do protecting the unborn when, as a nation, we are doing such a terrible job protecting those who are born?</EM>Pamelahttps://www.blogger.com/profile/13652737346135197054noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1467233175753661815.post-77274068028624046292008-10-20T15:36:00.000-04:002008-10-20T15:36:00.000-04:00Well, I guess I'm just hung up on "killing people"...Well, I guess I'm just hung up on "killing people" part of abortion. You, know that part about killing babies. I just can't get past it. <BR/>And to say that allowing kids to be born into a sucky environment is WORSE than killing them before they're born is- (tap tap tap, how do I say this?) -let's just say I think it moves one's focus away from the real issue. The world has sucky parts about it, but it doesn't really come to bear on the issue of killing little people. <BR/><BR/>Last thought:<BR/>"The plan for the life part" is this: Love your neighbor as yourself. We all have to do our part to make the sucky parts of our world less sucky. That's what Jesus said. And that's what he did. And that's what I try to do. And that is what you try to do, too. I know that because I know you and your various volunteer activities. <BR/>And, okay this is my last thought: I can't vote for someone who thinks its okay to kill babies on purpose under any circumstance. So, that's why it sways my vote. <BR/>(And, for the books: pro-life people are way NOT cool with people who kill doctors. Life is life, born or unborn, abortionist or not.)<BR/>I thank you for the opportunity to state my thoughts on this issue that is obviously close to my heart.<BR/>XOXO <BR/>JoceRebzhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/07800367551547396435noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1467233175753661815.post-39556213222584607962008-10-19T21:56:00.000-04:002008-10-19T21:56:00.000-04:00Oh, please don't think my position is 'throwing in...Oh, please don't think my position is 'throwing in the towel'. I'm not a throwing in the towel kind of girl.<BR/><BR/>There are a lot of people who desperately want to change the law regarding abortion. I don't believe that a change in the law will change anything except flip-flop the people who are pleased and irate, and cause women to go back to dirty back-alley uterus ripping joints.<BR/><BR/>What kind of job can we do protecting the unborn when, as a nation, we are doing such a terrible job protecting those who are born? <BR/><BR/>Hundreds of thousands of children are suffering in the foster care system in this country. Countless are abused, whether they are in their 'natural' homes or not. Where is the indignance? Where are the people lining the sidewalk with signs condemning abuse and hunger and lack of care? <BR/><BR/>Each was a fetus at one time. People spoke up for them then. <BR/><BR/>What does it say when there is an entire movement dedicated to saving the unborn, political candidates will recieve votes--or not--depending solely on this position, doctors are murdered? And not even a nationally-recognized slogan for the unloved children who are here.<BR/><BR/>The pro-life argument might be a little more compelling if there was a plan for the 'life' part.Pamelahttps://www.blogger.com/profile/13652737346135197054noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1467233175753661815.post-61791950928362256242008-10-19T21:13:00.000-04:002008-10-19T21:13:00.000-04:00Hey, Pamela,This whole discussion grieves me to th...Hey, Pamela,<BR/><BR/>This whole discussion grieves me to the core of my heart! <BR/><BR/>Psalm 139:13-16<BR/>"For you created my inmost being; you knit me together in my mother's womb. I praise you because I am fearfully and wonderfully made; your works are wonderful, I know that full well. My frame was not hidden from you when I was made in the secret place. When I was woven together in the depths of the earth, your eyes saw my unformed body. All the days ordained for me were written in your book before one of them came to be."<BR/><BR/>I'm glad you don't support abortion. Neither do I. And there was a lot in your blog post that I totally agree with.<BR/><BR/>But like Joce, I can't agree with your statement "Overturning Roe v. Wade will not make abortion to go away. It will make a bad situation worse."<BR/><BR/>How can upholding God's word and law (Deuteronomy 5:17) make a bad situation worse? Conversely, how can allowing murder in the name of a woman's "right to choose" be a godly position for those of us who claim to follow Christ? Yes, Jesus was compassionate, full of mercy, and forgiving of those who sinned. But he also cared for sinners while upholding the greatest of God's moral standards.<BR/><BR/>Maybe abortion is the end result of a flawed system. But just because a system is flawed doesn't mean you throw in the towel and say, well, you're going to do it anyways, so we'll allow it and make it easier for you. What if we applied that argument to all murder? Murder happens and sometimes people get killed other than the people that the killer really wanted to kill (sorry for this huge run-on sentence!). So in order to make murder "safer", we'll make it legal. We'll set up some murder "clinics" and so we'll reduce the killing of innocent bystanders. Yay! (please note my sarcasm)<BR/><BR/>It's totally absurd, isn't it??<BR/><BR/>And as far as the comment about imposing views on others - isn't that what our legal system does every day?? Murder is illegal. Is someone going to argue that because that goes back to the ten commandments in the Bible, that we should do away with this law? Again, it's just absurd.<BR/><BR/>So, sorry, I feel like I've gotten carried away. This is just such an important topic. As your first commenter said, <BR/><BR/>thus ends my (more than mini-)sermon.<BR/><BR/>Blessings,<BR/>StephanieAnonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1467233175753661815.post-49307933113695748462008-10-18T17:48:00.000-04:002008-10-18T17:48:00.000-04:00Pamela, thank you. Such complicated and often con...Pamela, thank you. Such complicated and often conflicting emotions need to be expressed in exactly the eloquent way you expressed them.Carol Pavliskahttps://www.blogger.com/profile/03368979644107669048noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1467233175753661815.post-9792980799049412032008-10-18T13:50:00.000-04:002008-10-18T13:50:00.000-04:00Just want to clarify: I didn't say abortion was a...Just want to clarify: I didn't say abortion was any sort of right, because I don't know how to even think about that. <BR/><BR/>Also, I didn't say that making it legal makes it better. I do believe that the legality causes the medical portion to be safer.<BR/><BR/>Carry on.Pamelahttps://www.blogger.com/profile/13652737346135197054noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1467233175753661815.post-69445948343309897052008-10-18T10:17:00.000-04:002008-10-18T10:17:00.000-04:00PS, Check out Feminists for Life: http://www.femin...PS, Check out Feminists for Life: http://www.feministsforlife.orgRebzhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/07800367551547396435noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1467233175753661815.post-84050618315614500722008-10-18T10:16:00.000-04:002008-10-18T10:16:00.000-04:00I see your heart behind your words. It is a good h...I see your heart behind your words. It is a good heart. I cannot say however, that abortion is a reproductive right. Or that making it legal makes it better. Abortion is not a good choice. I refuse to choose. Between women and children. I believe it is wrong to force women to choose between sacrificing her education of career plans and sacrificing her child. Women deserve better. Abortion is one more way for men to exploit women. "FREE SEX! NO BABIES! NO WORRIES!" For whom? For him. Because it is not free for her. Abortions are invasive- physically, emotionally, and psychologically. For whom? For the woman. Keeping abortion legal keeps it easy for the culture to keep telling women that their primary value is sexual.<BR/>And keeping it legal is confusing- we say, "It's wrong and awful, but we need to keep it as a right for the people it hurts the most (Almost the most, I think it hurts the baby more, but stay with me here). And finally, there are such things as absolutes- and killing little people is absolutely wrong. And keeping it legal keeps it looking like it must be the only choice and keeps women thinking that giving up their bodies and their children is the only thing of value that they have to give. And it makes them kill their babies. And that is not good for anyone's heart. Indiviually, and as a nation. Abortion is bad for our hearts.<BR/>XOXO<BR/>JoceRebzhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/07800367551547396435noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1467233175753661815.post-3726074053101712792008-10-18T00:07:00.000-04:002008-10-18T00:07:00.000-04:00Whoa. What an honest, insightful, and incredibly w...Whoa. What an honest, insightful, and incredibly well written post. No one likes abortion or celebrates the abortion procedure. But I would not want my reproductive rights or my daughter's reproductive rights managed or controlled by any government.<BR/><BR/>Thanks for sharing!Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1467233175753661815.post-50538050642005528852008-10-17T20:38:00.000-04:002008-10-17T20:38:00.000-04:00@the beth: I hope she comments. I'd like to hear...@the beth: I hope she comments. I'd like to hear her opinion, too.<BR/>So the beth's mom? Let 'er rip!Pamelahttps://www.blogger.com/profile/13652737346135197054noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1467233175753661815.post-52537906340988500342008-10-17T20:32:00.000-04:002008-10-17T20:32:00.000-04:00agreed. completely.good timing on this, my mom rec...agreed. completely.<BR/><BR/>good timing on this, my mom recently asked what your views on the matter were after i told her you were an obama supporter. i just sent this to her.Anonymousnoreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1467233175753661815.post-24051589764878992182008-10-17T14:27:00.000-04:002008-10-17T14:27:00.000-04:00I have no words... because you took them ALL right...I have no words... because you took them ALL right out of my mouth (fingers?). Great post.<BR/><BR/>And my mother's doctor actually offered to abort me.. since my mom wasn't real excited to be pregnant with a 6wk old baby at home.<BR/><BR/>'You don't HAVE to be pregnant, you know..'<BR/><BR/>she was disgusted.ChurchPunkMomhttps://www.blogger.com/profile/06935370275930996701noreply@blogger.comtag:blogger.com,1999:blog-1467233175753661815.post-90443627639259876442008-10-17T13:42:00.000-04:002008-10-17T13:42:00.000-04:00It's an ugly word. An ugly procedure. But I agree ...It's an ugly word. An ugly procedure. But I agree with you whole-heartedly. I'm an adoptive mom (you know that obviously) and my views on abortion always seem to startle and suprise people. I don't believe in the fundamentals of abortion, but I firmly believe in a woman's right to choose. If you outlaw abortion, it will still happen. It will be in seedy, dirty clinics and it will cause more harm. Education, tolerance, openess is the key. Marking abortion illegal is like cutting off the the tail of a snake, not the head. It creats a big mess. I know it's odd, but I'm glad that my birth moms were able to choose. One of them almost didn't choose life. We've even talked about it at length. She felt ashamed for telling me. I told her that I didn't judge her at all. It was something she had to decide and journey through for herself.<BR/><BR/>I know as an adoptive mom, people expect me to fall into one category over the other. But my gut just tells me that I can't inflict my beliefs on someone else. I don't want the government to do that to me or to anyone else either. Education. Education. I can't say it enough. Birth control, talking about it in schools, but more importantly IN YOUR HOME. Thanks for being brave and writing this. :) I heart you and your dirty (clean) soap nuts even more.steenky beehttps://www.blogger.com/profile/07570171606663745423noreply@blogger.com